The Audible-Ready Sales Podcast
The Audible-Ready Sales Podcast

Episode · 2 years ago

25. How Successful Companies Implement MEDDICC w/ Brian Walsh

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Many sales leaders want to add MEDDICC into their sales organizations to improve sales qualification, mitigating losses and the number of deals in the pipeline that just aren’t progressing effectively.

 

Spoiler -  just adding the tool to your sales process won’t drive results. You as a sales leader, and your sales teams have to put in the work to make it work.

 

In this episode, Managing Director of Facilitation and Delivery, Brian Walsh talks through how to enable your sales teams to drive results using MEDDICC. He’ll cover:

 

- The three sales qualification questions MEDDICC can help companies solve

 

- How you can make MEDDICC successful, specifically for your organization

 

- How leaders, managers, sales reps impact the success of MEDDICC in different ways

 

- Personal experiences on how managers can help reps move deals forward in a way that drives results

 

Check out this and other episodes of The Audible-Ready Podcast at Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or our website.

 

Here are some additional resources focused on implementing MEDDICC: 

 

- An Overview of MEDDICC 

https://bit.ly/31uSNxz

- Make MEDDICC Work for Your Sales Organization

https://bit.ly/2CaI8zG

- How Sales Messaging & Qualification Work Together to Drive Scalable Growth

https://bit.ly/3kix1pH

If you're going to do something like this, you should be really thinking about what does good look like six months after we've been through medic and then, well then, what does it take for us to get to that moment six months from now? Starting today, you're listening to the audible ready podcast, the show that helps you and your team's sell more faster. Will feat your sales leader sharing their best insights on how to create a sales engine that helps you fuel repeatable revenue growth, presented by the team at force management, a leader in Bob sales effectiveness. Let's get started. Hello and welcome to the audible ready podcast. I'm Rachel Clap Miller, and today we are talking about medic. Brian Walls joins me to discuss this methodology. Hey, Brian, good morning, High Rachel. How are you? I'm good, Brian. I know that you do a lot of trainings on medic. You work with a lot of sales organizations on medic. Those of you who don't know or might be as a little bit more unfamiliar with it, medic is a sales qualification methodology. It's very popular. Brian, just let's start off here. Give us a little information about why you think it works so well. It works so well because it helps organizations answer three questions, and I think that's the big thing. Like if you can keep focused on these three big questions. And the first question is, is this a deal we even belong in? Right, I mean so, am I involved in opportunities that I really should be spending time? And then the second question it helps orderizations answer suthing yes to the first is what do we do to effectively move this deal forward? What and how do we do, and when do we do things to move the deal forward? And answers that question. And then last one, at least it answers the question where is this deal really at? So, yeah, I think some people go straight to the third question is calling the forecast more accurately. And that's it. That's true that. That's one example,...

...but it's bigger than that. That is on sale stage right, putting a deal in close or, you know, in a position where you can forecast it. But every step of the way, every step of your sales cycle, you really have a lot more competences to where the deal truly is at all time. Right. As as we know, there's not a sales leader out there who doesn't want to predict revenue more accurately if they're not already there? Right. So medic, I know this is audio, right, people are listening to this. So medic is an is an acronym if you don't know. It's metrics, economic buy our decision criteria, decision process. I identifying pain champions and competitions. Sometimes people put it extra P in. Therefore, Medpick for paper process, depending on your organization. But given this current environment, were in this economic environmant. In Our Marketing Department at Force we've had a lot of traffic, digital traffic, around medic. People are looking for better ways to qualify. Mean even our medic site traffic last month was up twenty five percent. So let's talk about how you make medic successful in your organization. Yeah, I you know, I think there's a lot to that and I'll go back to my three questions. I think that, and the first two is really what this is all about. The idea that first and foremost, I'm focused on helping people in might on my team or in the rest of my organization think through opportunities early in such a way that we're deciding in a better way or better educated way, which deals are we really going to dive into? which are the ones that are more apt for us to be successful in, are closer to our bulls eye kind of opportunity or client? And then, secondarily, once we're in those deals, it's all about focusing on the the what and the how every step of the way right. So you can't just launch medic and give it to your teams and put it in sales force and hope that it's going to be enough, because it's not going to be enough. In fact, I've told clients before,...

...if that's what you're going to do, don't do it. It's just a waste of your time and money. You're not going to get the outcomes that you're looking for. It's really the concept of putting into work daily in every conversation that we have, that actually makes a significant difference. So it's really about how an individual seller and the people working with him or her who are a part of what I call an opportunity pursue team. There they're working a live deal. It's how they put it into place. But it's also how then management does a couple of things. It's how they run the business every day and how they have those conversations about live deals that really really matter, that really makes this thing stick right, so that the the qualification accuracy that you get out of this really comes from a sales leadership team that establishes a cadence or an operating rhythm around the concept of coaching both deals and skill instead of just you know, you know our favorite phrase, a one of them Rachel, screaming in the scoreboard, right, the manager. You know, the difference here is you, you you either have a manager who screams at the scoreboard, that you go, you can on a call with them and talk about an opportunity and you hear something like well, you know what you need to do? You need to go get a meeting with the economic fire right. That, like that's screaming in the scoreboard, because they're replicity. They're saying themselves. Well, yeah, thanks, like I already knew that. Right. Instead, it's hey, let's talk about like the like the manager was all around coaching the deal and coaching skill is focused on, as you and I've talked about anythings, or the what and the how. So it's okay, we all know that we got to get to the economic fire right. Let's talk about two things. How are we going to get to the economic fire and when we get there, how are we going to set that meeting up and choreograph that meeting so that we're actually talking to the economic buyer in language that they care about and we're communicating value in a way that they actually will attach to? Right. So, you know, a big...

...example for me, was it still six with me, was last all I was with five people working on an opportunity in one of our clients, and I chage you not when I say this. The seller said, Hey, I just got a call. This was a Thursday afternoon. I just got a call from the Chief Operating Officers Office for this large healthcare system with twenty six locations in southeastern faith and I'm meeting with the Chief Operating Officer next Tuesday. And the manager said, and I quote, Hey, that's great. Let me know if you need me help and proceeded to ask a question about something wholly different inside of these same opportunity and I stopped and I'm in just ask the interest of them. Are you have any interest in this meeting with the TEAP operating officer? And he said well, sure, and I said can I ask the rap a couple questions and he said sure, and I looked at the rap and I said, Hey, how many times you met with a Chief Operating Officer of an organization is big? And I could tell, because of his age, that the answer was going to be what it was, and it was sorrow. And I looked at the Mancher I said I have a few of the questions, but you want to jump in and where the manager jump in, and we spent the next forty five minutes talking about the call right and I and and, instead of good luck, it was what we are the injectives. What's the the agenda? How do we know that she, the Chief Operating Officer, is aligned with that? What's the choreographer? Because choreography, because the good news is the two other people at the table with the rep were going on that meeting too, so we had all the right people in the room to have the how conversation. That's what I'm talking about. That, yeah, now, how is is so important, which is why we always talk about it, because that screaming at the scoreboard concept you just talked about isn't going to get you to forecast accuracy. Yeah, because it's you know what Rachel. It's not just not going to get you that. Yeah, it's also here's the other thing it's going to get you. It's going to get you a bunch of reps who resent the moment they see your name on their calendar because they look at it and they're like, oh great, I have to go report the news again, right, instead of really figuring out how are we going to make the news?...

That's the difference. That's great. You know, it's manic. is so much like any sales methodology that you implement. You need to customize it to fit your organization. So let's talk about how you make it successful specifically in your organization, and I sort of thought we'd break this down into three lenses, leaders, managers and Reps. so let's start with managers. How does the manager you talked a little bit about just now, but let's dive in a little bit deeper. How do managers make the successful? You know, you didn't know I was going to tell you this, but on a personal note, I had something really tragic happened yesterday of a very good, long time friend of mine from Xerox suddenly passed away. I'm sorry. Yeah, thanks. I got the news last night and I was thinking about Dan this morning as I was thinking about our podcast, and I realized, as I was talking to some other formers, Zax people last night, people that I'd worked three years and many of them have been mentors, that the one thing that Dan, who was us a long time seller, he actually he sold his whole career. But the one thing that Dan and people like Tom Growl and Dave Alfredo, Jeff Canada, like the names just roll off my tongue, did for me is what great leaders do at the frontline level every day they have a cadens and where they know that the most important thing to do every single day is to not just talk about the forecast, right, but it's to be way in front of the forecast and to talk about live eels and talk about them as it relates to moving the deal forward. Like and I I know it sounds like a broken record because we just talked about the how men to go, but the reality is to new organizations and managers spent all the time chasing the forecast and, as one of the other great sales managers ever had, Fred Thomas, used to say, on the first day of the quarter, because we would forecast our business quarterly, and the...

...forecast you put down on day one was the forecast you went through the quarter with. You didn't get a lot of love if you showed up halfway through the quarter saying, Hey, I got to reduce my forecast, by which, all right, Fred Freddie would literally, on day one of the quarter, start telling everybody you realize that the quarter is over right and as point was, if you think you're going to pull a whole bunch of deals forward into the quarter that are there are only half baked in Januine on the first day of the quarter, you're crazy. So his whole concept was you have to be way in front of the quarter. So in this quarter I'm thinking about next quarters deals, so that when we call the number on the first day of the quarter, we know that the number is the number. And it was always focused on how what are we what are we going to do to move this deal forward, and how are we going to do that? What's the strategy? What's the choreography? And that's what people like can my friend and others, the other names that I just threw it you were all so good at doing right, and I think the number one thing that a frontline manager has to do is get really great at facilitating these conversations, which means you don't have to be the expert, number right, but you have to be able to get to be great at facilitating these conversations and it has to be the number one thing, along with pipeline generation, on your in your operator rhythm and your cadence, right, whether that's daily, weekly, monthly, because everybody's business is different based on the velocity of the deals they work on and the size of the deals they work on. But you got to have an operating rhythm that you that you absolutely live by, and this, in my opinion, has to be one of the top two things in that operating room. It is nonnegotiable. Yeah, I think you know. We've talked about the how and facilitating the conversations to make your reps successful. In medic helps drive that. But the other thing, really the underlying thing that I'm hearing here, is in these deal coach coaching sessions or when you're using medic to evaluate a deal, managers providing the how, but they're providing...

...a how and how you make sure that you are aligned to the biggest business took pain and your solution is aligned to the biggest business plan. It's that fundamental. Well, it's it's that fundamental and it's really deep, if you think about that right. It's the idea that most of the decisions were talking about, including multiple players, which means there's multiples, typically multiple problems, or at least levels of the same problem that I should be able to attach to and dig into. And there's two sides to that coin, right, there's two sides to the pain. The first side is the concept of what's happening as a result of the issues you're dealing with today or have that you have that. The second side of that coin is what happens if you don't affectedly deal with those and I think like that's that's just one of those little salt of things that a lot of people miss and it's one of those ways that you can start to keep front of the pain and start to expand the circle of people who are involved in this discussion or are going to be impact. And then the other side of that coin, the third leg of that school, is what's possible on the other side, because you know, you and I both know we've seen this mult of times and we preach it a lot that most customers, left to their own devices, are you have a point of view as to where they are and where they're trying to go, and and that, if that, is very rarely wrong right. where the customers where they're trying to go always has some blidd a lot of alluding to it. But what we typically should be able to bring to the table, with some expertchiefs in some experience, is to be able to help the customer think through the what's going on today issue more deeply than they would have if we weren't room and what's possible on the other side and if you can expand that and really get the thing about other outcomes. But starts to happen is you start to have an impact on the on the Roli discussion inside of the customer. You know the customer will spend one amount of money to fix a one hundred thousand dollar problem. They'll spend another amount of money just to get to a half a million dollar outcome right, and any CFO worth their salt will tell you that that's truth. I've tested that theory probably thousands of times...

...now in my career, both in this life and my previous life, and I've never had a CFO disagree with the concept that adding a really solid set of business outcomes helps them better think through and justify whether or not the decision they're about to make is a big one. Yeah, well, sad and well said, and I also think Rachel I aposized. But I want to get hit something else. We know we were talking about management. I think the other side of that coin is, you know, there's first line managers and what they do and what I'm what I'm dealing with in my own head, in my heart right now, kind of to be the first line manager. But the other thing that matters here is the leaders above the front line leader. And write this conversation with the pliant last week and and I just said, listen, what's really going to matter here is your first line managers are all lined up there, they're ready to go. Question they're going to have, and one of them is already asked me privately, is is the leadership of the company going to make it both an expectation for me to run the businesses way and are they going to allow me to run the businesses way? Are they going to talk this way? Right? So it's like it's one thing to make it an expectation. It's another thing to make it okay. And that's where second line leadership and everybody above have got at. That's how they've got to be thinking of running the business every yeah, what do you let's let's talk a little bit about the sales leader role in implementing medic when you when you talk about running the business based on that, what do you what do you mean? What does that mean? What does that look like? Well, it goes back to what we talked about a few minutes ago, this concept of an operating rhythm. Right, you've got in your rest. have to know that in any given moment there's a chance that you're going to say, Hey, Rachel, let's talk about that deal in your pipeline and and that when you say when I say that to you, I'm saying it not as an inspection point. In fact, I suggest get that word out of your vocabulary. I say it as a coaching point. Can I say it that as yeah, let's take a look at this opportunity and...

...let's look at it early and often as appropriate. And I think the to dynamics there that matter are the rest skill set and the size of the opportunity right and it's important business right. And so, as a front of my manager, I'm looking at those two things at all times and I'm asking myself, Hey, looks like Rachel's got herself a tiger by the tail. Does she have the skill set to deal with that? and Or is this a deal big enough of consequence to both her and the team? If either of those two answers, you know, lead me to the idea that we better sit down and talk about the deal. It's time to sit down talk about the deal and it's not just a onetime thing. So I'm talking about opportunities early and often in a way that I pull the seller and the rest of the account team away from further away from the deal so they can see the fourth so my role is to facilitate that conversation and like like. I'll just give you an example. Back in February I was helping a manager coach a deal out west with us a sales rep who's in a mid market sales position is average deal size is about fiftyzero dollars and his quota for the years about six hundredzerolls. And I walk into a room where they were working on Sixtyzero deal, you know, one year contract, sixtyzero deals and a lot of their initial contracts, or one year because it's kind of a newer market place and clients like, okay, we'll give you a twelve months try. Kind of right. We started talking about the opportunity and attaching the biggest problem and then work and we started mapping out all the different people and customers organization that would care about the thing that these guys do for living. And before you knew it, using medic we had mapped out the fact that there are another six or seven people, to include VP of application development, who really, really needed to be heard, that this was actually going to get some legs and be successful, whether, no matter what, the customer decided to buy up front in terms at we were thinking about successful implementation. Right, right. So what we did was we mapped out of strategy on how to get...

...to these other people and conversations they have which, with each of them, triangulate the truth. And I stayed in touch with the rap in, the manager or the next number of weeks, and three or three weeks go now. Three weeks ago, I got a note from the rap the the conversation had morphed six seven different times, to the point that by the time a couple people internally took it to the VP of application development, the VP took one look at the summary, what we like to affectionately call the mantra, because the command and the message customer to but took one look at the Mantra said let's call right, let's get these folks on the phone. I definitely want to talk to them. And after a few conversations with this rap and his team, the one year sixtyzero deal went to a three year, one point four seven million dollar deal. Wow, the REP wrote his year in one deal. Wow. Does that happen all the time now? Of course not. Right. But but what medic does, when applied really, really well at the how level, is it helps us think through all of these things were pumping about. How do I better identify the pain and identify all the people who are attached to it and then figure out of strategy to get to each one of those folks and help those folks connect the doctor internally. That's the whole concept here. So let's talk a little bit. We talked about managers and even higher up leaders the importance of providing the how as you just went through. But still the sellers got to own the medic process and make sure that they're holding them themselves accountable to that. What do you what are the responsibilities of sales rep to make sure medic is successful? Yeah, I I'm so glad you wanted to talk about this too, because I actually think at a higher level, first and foremost, an organization who does something like this well actually starts to identify the right people for the organization. And I don't just mean at the seller level, it's also at the manager level and the manager of managers level. So that's the first thing. You're identifying...

...what great looks like for your organization, and then you're identifying. So who were the WHO were the players in any role that actually are up for the challenge, who are up for the skill right, because that's what we're also trying to always who are always trying to up our game, and identifying great talent includes the concept of identifying people who are willing to do the work for right. That's and that's an example, I think here at an individual contributor level, sales raft solutions are contect anybody else who touches the customer over the courts of the journey. I think reps have a response. So I'll say reps to include all those different botes they have. They have the responsibility to take the learning that they're getting every several of the way of medic and apply it to every opportunity they're working on as appropriate. Now I worry when I say as appropriate, people say, oh, that means for a small deal item. No, it's not a bookcase. Means as appropriate. Right, we don't let the process trump common sense, but we don't use it as a bush either. The Hind Line, so, or what I believe, Rachel, is you got to have reps who are willing to do their part, play their role, which includes some of the stuff that people don't always love, like you got to put the details of the opportunity into sales forts or whatever, your system of records. And the reason I is the sales rep do that is not just so that I can check a box that I did it, but it's so that I can hold others responsible and accountable. It means that if I'm going to take the time to keep feel up to pain, it means that anytime we're going to sit down and talk about the deal. Everybody shows up with a point of view because they've actually looked salesports tractor. And if we have twenty minutes to talk about an opportunity, we don't spend twenty minutes or eighteen minutes of re telling you about the opportunity. Human is talking about the way. We've flipped a completely. We spent two min it's making sure everybody's up speed and we were answering any questions that might not be completely answered in the in the deal record. And then we spend...

...eighteen minutes talking about what are we going to do, how are we going to do it? When are we going to do it? Who's going to do it? And if you do that, well, right, if you said that expectation up. Well, now reps have more than an understanding that they're expected to do something. They will do it because they know they're going to get value out of the process. That's that's right. Yeah, that I think. I think that's the thing. And then the other thing that happens is rep spring, you know, because a rep is doing their part on the front end and everybody shows up collectively to talk about deals ready to go. Reps now earn the right to do something else, which is to hold the rest of the account team accountable, to include their manager and their managers manager, for the appropriate types of action and resource right so that you know I'm doing my part. I should be able to now hold the company accountable for resources that I need and the company should be willing to look in the I and tell me that they can or why they can't, give me the resources that I need to get a deal time. So I think, because that's the other thing, like you talk to organizations that through this, well, they'll tell you when we really understand how the more typical you know or whatever, that is seventy or eight percent of the business we write, when we really see and how those deals get done, because we use something like medical qualify them, it's a lot easier for us to make the right bets on how we hire additional roles, how we change the customer journey in terms of when certain roles come in or out of the conversation. So that's the other things. Start to have company starts to get a better picture of how man these deals really go down and where should we be investing in the sales team? Is it we need more rept is it we need more throusial architects on the details and wholesale side. So that's the other things start to happen. Yeah, I think it's about giving when you know where you are with the forecast and where your pipeline is, you are able to make better...

...decisions about your business. And that comes with that discipline, around the medic principles that ensure your sales people are spending effective their time effectively and, as you said, they need the resources in the processes and that internal support to do so. And it has to be a company language, which you talked about earlier, that nearly a hundred percent forecast accuracy or a hundred percent for cats accuracy is possible and sales leaders own that to drive that throughout the organization. Yeah, I talked about this with sales series all the time. I asked them, you know what, what feedback do you get from your cellers about of the conversations you have about moving deals forward? And it's pretty typical. It's you know, we talk about the deal and then everybody walks away shaking their head. Yes, but the deals don't really move as much as we thought they might based on whatever conversation we had and then when you ask managers why, they eventually get to the understanding that what they're doing, as I mentioned earlier, is they're asking reps to come in just report the news. It's like has asking somebody to come in and read the newspaper to them. And and if you can get your organization focused on creating executable action in the twenty minutes you have or three minutes you have to talk about a lot of deal, you end up with a bunch of sellers walking around, though, and when I see my manager's name pop up on my calendar, I actually look forward to that because I know that I'm going to get value. And I think this is important to say again, not because my manager called a meeting, but because when I sit down with my manager and the other people who are involved in a deal, we actually have a conversation about how are we going to move the deal forward. So now the managers doing two things that want. They're helping move the business more effectively than they ever have before, right and providing better accuracy for themselves in the business in terms of forecasts. But the other thing they're doing is they're teaching skill that the REP...

...will now start to apply to every deal they're working on, not just the one deal they're in, because it's now not just about go ahead, Rachel, go get a meeting with somebody, psyche. Let's talk about how we're going to get this meeting. What are the objectives? What's the agenda look like? How do we know that person's going to be lined up ahead of time? Those kinds of things, and now there's an expect that I can start to set over early. Right the great now, how do we make sure that you're going to do this every time you're meeting with an economic fire? So that's the other thing. I'm making an impact on one deal, which then has a halo effect on every other deal in a repch type one. For the skill set I'm building for the REP long term is it's immense. Yeah, there's it is living and breathing this qualification. We used to the conceptoracious beaver. Be A veracious qualifier. Yeah, but it's also investing the time, money resources to really make this the language of your organization. That you said it earlier. You don't just launch medic right. It's all these things. Is surrounded and sales leaders own that. We have that concept of leading from the front and that's what makes medic really successful. Yeah, and I know an organization's got it when two things are going on, when frontline managers have an ongoing cadence. You know, for example, every manager in North America Tuesdays from five eastern is doing deal opportunity conversation, right, and they're picking the deals in the moment that make the most sense to talk about. And depending on the deal size, you might get through three, you might get through six, you might get through to you know, but you, for your team, are having a conversation and at the same time executive leadership is engaged in that cadence as well. And what they're doing is they're coming into these reviews not with the intense and naturally unnecessarily participate and jump in, but with the intend to coach the managers right. So the manager's job is to coach skill to the rap. How do we move this deal forward and how do we collectively get better at these types of connotations for customers? The managers of managers, they have a responsibility frontline managers how to be...

...great coaches. So if frontline managers are running these reviews and everybody above them are involved, you have no idea how good you're setting your frontline managers doing this right, what their sad is. And then number two, it will be eventually become clearly your frontline managers that you're not even run into business as well, versus some of our clients, and you know who I'm talking about, the the the top of the funnel, but a man of the woman sitting in the Chief Evan Officers Chair is actually sometimes running reviews, is personally involved in reviews, is listening in the coach the manager and when you talk to you, I'm just singing of the names Mike and Jim and saying some of these folks that we know really, really well, Carlos, when you talk to them about a deal back, I can think of a CEO up in Boston. When you talk to him, he'll start talking to you about your opportunity using medic language in the same way that a frontline manager would not to inspect but to coach the deal. That's when you know. I mentioned the increased effect we've seen around medic I think in this ever environment, particularly Brian, qualification is going to make or break some of these sales organizations this year. Yeah, and I think I think you. I like the way you said it. Some well, I'll be the first limit that not all, but for a lot of organizations, the ability to be honest with ourselves about where a deal truly is. Let's balance. That's that's the first reason to do this, to be honest with ourselves as to is this a real deal, is this a deal we really belong in, and where is it really at in the process? To be honest with ourselves about that allows us to then think about, okay, so what? What are the rightness next actions and how do we execute on those, especially in this environment where you know people have been, or maybe still might be, somewhat paralyzed. Right...

...customers have gone missing. You know what I mean? I mean that, you know, everybody's kind of gone underground a little bit at certain different places. Now people back out. You know, that's what's going on. It's harder to get a hold of people. Lots of companies are in you know, everybody's everybody's business is shifting right now. Right people had to go in to survival mode or had to go and do change our messaging mode or something like that. So something like this to just have an honest take on where our business really is and then to make some really good decisions educated the systems. But what should we be doing and how is that different than what we would have done three months ago? Right? That's great, Brian. Is there any other final thoughts around this concept that you want to share that I did ask you about kind it kind of came out earlier, but I would just say this. I really think that organizations be think about if you're gone to do something like this, as our friend the sales cremugion with today, you know you're probably not going to be willing to do it the way it needs to be done right. So you know our friend the sales cremntion likes to take the negative point of view. Of course people to think a little differently. I would just say it this way. If you're going to do something like this, you should be really thinking about what does good look like six months after we've been molemented and then, well then, what does it take for us to get to that moment six months from now, starting today? And if you're not willing to do the heavy lifting that it takes to make something like this stick in your organization, don't do it. Just don't do it. I mean, don't waste your time and your money. And if you can't get your arms around the value of something like this for your organization, that's okay. Just don't do it. Don't do it just to do it. It won't stick. And you know that's my whole thing on this. Now, if you want to be great the greatest sales organizations of...

...the world, do you this? I need do it. Well, yeah, and if you can hear it, go ahead. I'm sorry, Nice saying. If you can do the work and put them muscle behind it. You those organizations that do. They rate their rewards. Yeah, and that's a universal truth. You can't debate that just can't be debated. So, yeah, I hope that helps. It was really fun talking to you to that. Yes, Brian, thank you so much and thank you to all of you who are listening out there. We know that you're listening and so many of you are grinding every day trying to get these deals in the pipeline and close. If there's ever a topic that you want us to cover on the podcast you want to hear some more information about, please email us podcast at force MANAGEMENTCOM. Thank you, Brian, thanks Rachel, and thank you, everybody. Yes, thank you to all of you for listening. At force management, we're focused on transforming sales organizations into elite teams. Are Proven methodologies deliver programs that build company alignment and fuel repeatable revenue growth. Give your teams the ability to execute the growth strategy at the point of sale. Our strength is our experience. The proof is in our results. Let's get started. Visit US at force MANAGEMENTCOM. You've been listening to the audible ready podcast. To not miss an episode, subscribe to the show in your favorite podcast player. Until next time,.

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